No?
Me neither.
I was going to, but then there was this alumni event for my high school tonight, and, for whatever reason, I decided to go and forgot to set my DVR. It wasn’t a class reunion — I didn’t go to high school in Seattle — it was just an event for all alumni who live in Seattle to mix and mingle. The one guy from my class who I was friends with who lives here bailed at the last minute, but I went anyway. It was really weird because there were all these people there that I kinda-sorta knew in high school — or I knew their siblings — but never really talked to or hung out with, and now, nearly ten years later, I had a total blast spending time with them on a Friday night. It was so weird, walking into that room and spotting people who were a couple grades above me, who had been so intimidating when I was 14, but now are just way awesome and fun to reminisce with.
One of the faculty members there walked up to me and was like, “Wow, it’s really you. You know, I saw your name on the RSVP list, but, to tell you the truth, I didn’t think you’d actually show up. I think about you often, you know. I always wondered what became of you.” And another faculty member was like, “I didn’t know you lived in Seattle,” and looked at me like he expected some manner of response, so I just kind of rudely blurted out, “Uh … I did,” and he was like, “Ah, yes, that’s the girl we know and love.”
Was I really that obnoxious in high school?
Clearly I was.
See, you guys, I spent a lifetime preparing for this job. :)
Anyway.
If you want to talk about the debates, this is the thread to do it in.
Who came out on top?
I honestly expected Obama to Kick McCain’s Ass. This is Obama’s core competency!! This is where he shines!! Such an engaging quick-on-his-feet-speaker. WRONG.
Obama, by and large, came off as petulant, angry and snide. He had some good moments, but overall, IMO, not a good showing.
McCain was surprisingly well prepared and almost always smooth in his delivery. He came off as SEASONED, Executive, Sage, and in control of the event and Obama. I think he ran the show. Obama may be (usually) the Sizzle, but McCain was the Steak.
I have flip flopped many times over the course of the Campaign…..Obama, McCain….no, OBAMA. I could not in good conscience vote for Obama, and feel safe sleeping at night. I can’t place my vote out of a feeling of trying to do something symbolic, or in reparations. I like Obama. I thick he’s a very intelligent and well spoken guy. I look forwarding to casting a vote for him one day, but not in this election.
McCain was absolutely Presidential, and showed insight into his leadership, a pragmatic, no-nonsense approach and a sense of humor. I have to vote for McCain, and I want to vote for McCain.
Well Done John.
Why wouldn’t he look at Obama? Seemed a bit petulant. Anyway, I thought they were both pretty beige.
i have to agree with lynn. i think that obama went into the debate with a leg up (in the polls) and especially a presumptuous attitude that mccain would be flustered, curt,and not as eloquent as he was last night. Obama went into that debate thinking that he was going to get under mccain’s skin while exactly the opposite happened. Obama looked nervous, diverged from the questions (what was that one tangent on how americans are paying at the pump because of the conflict in south ossetia)? I found his answer filled with completely irrelevant, vacuous words whereas mccain seemed thoughtful, prudent,and on the ATTACK. Mccain grilled Obama last night. Truely unexpected!
The whole debate was kind of disappointing for me. they both did well but kind of blah. It felt like Obama had been holding back and McCain looked like it was past his bedtime. McCain kept saying things like ‘What Obama doesn’t understand” and “I have been to _____-stan”. It was very frustrating. I live tweeted the whole thing along with a ton of other people which made it more interesting, but I expected a bit more from them. Maybe not McCain, because he was crazy old, but I expected him to make some kind of eye contact toward Obama (glad to see I’m not the only one who noticed that). It was all very weird to be quite honest. very blah.
Obama sounded inexperienced and petulant and McCain sounded old and dated. I was bi-partisanly (yeah, it’s a word in my world) unimpressed.
John McCain came across as an angry, obnoxious, condescending drama queen who DID NOT have his facts correct and kept referring to simple fundamental differences in principle as “naivety” and “he doesn’t understand” Yes, he does understand, John, he just doesn’t agree with you. We need a diplomat in this world and John McCain is not capable of that. He seemed, at times, to float from the subject in obvious attempts to distract from the question at hand. He continually attempted to play the sympathy card. He refused to make eye contact with Obama. He looked hunched over and puckered up. He irritated me and made me realize a vote for him was a vote for George Bush X10. And I SURE don’t want that MORON Sara Palin as a VP! Jesus Christ, did anyone see that Couric interview! That was stunning and not in a good way!
I watched them and felt there was no clear cut “winner or loser”. They both spoke well and both showed strong suits.
I am an Obama supporter but McCain did do well at showing how much experience he has in dealing with foreign affairs. He did his job, to plant doubt in my head as to if Obama was prepared to deal with the worlds leaders and issues. I am on the fence about that one.
I thought McCain looked as though he was losing his cool a few times while Barack stayed pretty level. The exchange about Kissenger was awkward to say the least.
I will be interested in seeing the VP debates next week. “I can see the Russia from my house” lol!
#1. Beet, a few weeks back you went on and on about how you didn’t know how to inform yourself about each candidate and then you skip out on things like watching the debate?
#2. Lynn and anyone else who called Obama “petulant” – what debate were you watching??????
Obama was controlled, calm, confident and above all respectful – almost too respectful toward McCain. McCain twitched and grimaced and stared straight at his podium while Obama spoke. McCain spoke straight to Lehrer and NOT ONCE did he look at Obama. Obama looked straight at McCain while McCain spoke. Obama often, not always, looked straight at McCain while he (Obama) was speaking.
Obama’s responses were extremely well-thought out and coherent points that were filled with substance, while most of McCain’s points were ringing with the familiar tunes of “I’m a maverick” and “I was a POW”
I watched the debate with several people and after the second time John McCain said “Obama doesn’t understand” we started a little drinking game. It was hilarious and so freaking transparent – this typical Republican tactic (or maybe it’s a strategy?) of repeating something over and over and over again with the hope that saying it enough times will make it the truth. Unfortunately, that’s not the case and Obama is so far above and beyond that kind of crap….
#3. combjockey (? what does that mean?) – I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU!!!!!!
I watched it. I was disgusted at McFossil and his lack of respect for either Obama and Jim. He would interrupt, tell Obama how “he doesn’t understand” and was a complete arrogant jackass.
I loved the “maverick” and the fact that he’s traveled to all of these countries and how he’s such “good friends with Kissinger”. Whatever.
He’s a douchebag.
Obama held his own. He was very direct. He did look McFossil in the eye and I have to admit he did fumble a few times. He did keep his composure, unlike the other guy. He never threw out ridiculous barbs like the old dude.
I can’t wait til next week. Biden vs Palin. I’m clearing my schedule…
First I noticed John McCains total lack of eye contact. And as the debates went on, he seemed to be so condescending towards Obama, and kind of mean too, like laughing when he seemed to frustrate Obama with the nonsense he kept spewing like “we are winning in Iraq”. Also he kept saying he was never voted “MISS Congeniality”, he said it like twice, I wonder if it was a shout out to his VP’s Pageant days. Hmm….
I felt McCain really needed this debate to prove himself worthy, especially because of his recent erratic behaviour, as well as the scrutiny the Mute Sarah Palin as been putting herself and him under.
McCain has way more foreign policy experience than Obama, in the sense that the guy has been in politics practically as long as Obama has been alive, so he had the chance to really pull through here and make Obama seem like the naive rookie that the Republicans want so whole heartidly. BUT Obama DEFINITELY held his ground….And compared to his lack of experience next to McCain, someone watching for the first time probably wouldnt be able to tell. Besides, With all the Experience that John McCain has in years, he seems to lack in maturity–the guy seems like a complete dickhead.
To me, it was tie. I definitely agreed with Obama though, he seemed way more genuine and passionate. McCain just seemed too cool and condescending for his own good. It would have really benefited McCain to come out on top, but Obama is a strong competetor and wouldnt allow that so Kudos to Obama!!
Umm…how did Angry One’s “Muslim nigger” comment get past the censor’s? It is clearly a violation of your Guide to Comment policy, is it not Beet?
WTF WAS UP WITH MCCAIN NEVER LOOKING AT OBAMA DURING THE DEBATE?!
I have the dubious advantage of having listened to the debate without watching it… Obama sounded bratty, and repeatedly interrupted McCain with strong arguments like, “That’s not TRUE!” just like a child. I’m not really a huge supporter of either, honestly, but I laughed out loud when Obama countered McCain’s story of getting a bracelet from the mother of a deceased soldier with something like, “Well, for the record, I got a bracelet, TOO!” cause seriously, I have heard six-year-olds fight just like that.
As far as who made better arguments, like most debates, it comes down to who you agree more with. I’m not a huge fan of either.
This whole thing was a complete waste of time. On so many occasions neither of the candidates would answer the given questions directly, then, slam the other while going completely off topic, causing their opponent to rant an additional rebuttal instead of moving on. John McCain took every opportunity to bring up his military background (and sometimes sounding like he wanted to stay in this war indefinitely as long as the military could come out proud with a “win”) as well as his experience crossing over party lines… at every unnecessary opportunity called Obama’s opinions naive (with no support or evidence for these claims because he has none) and on one occasion went as for as to suggest Barack didn’t know what strategy was…
it became obvious, excessive, and downright annoying. I don’t feel like either came out a winner, Obama didn’t seem prepared enough, and McCain just filled his arguments with jabs at Obama and “my experience with (something irrelevant) instead of real facts and information.
Why had I expected more? After all, this is politics.
Respect? Condescending?? How many times did Obama refer to McCain as “John”? Its Senator McCain as you are Senator Obama. We are not electing a diplomat, we are electing a President, also known as the Commander in chief. The debate was fairly predictable, however, I hope that more time is allotted to Foreign Policy since it was to be a Foreign Policy debate with additional debates to take place in the coming weeks regarding additional topics. Its fairly obvious who the Obama voters are on this blog. As far as real facts and info, maybe Obama needs to look back on his Kissinger comments cause he was dead wrong on what Kissinger said. And this is coming from an Independent.
“#1. Beet, a few weeks back you went on and on about how you didn’t know how to inform yourself about each candidate and then you skip out on things like watching the debate?”
I know I didnt watch it when it originally aired… but they ran that debate all night and I am sure anyone can find it on the internet if you look for it.
That whole “Sen. Obama doesn’t know the difference between tactic and strategy” statement was ridiculous. Does he think that talking down to a HARVARD GRAD endears him to the middle class that he seems to have forgotten??
Honestly, it was politics as usual. My mind has been made up since day one simply because I vote Democrat because I believe in what the party stands for. Nonetheless, I was disappointed to find that they both sounded like lying sacks of shit.
My friends and I watched it, and basically made fun of McCain the entire time. I don’t think that Obama clearly came out over McCain; neither of them were outstanding. However, McCain needed to come out clearly over Obama, and he didn’t. He looked like an incompetent ass, and he kept contradicting himself, as he has done throughout most of his campaign. Even though Obama didn’t shine, he still showed more foresight to what Jim was actually asking instead of just spouting out names of people he’s “known for 30 years! Like, bff!” While neither of them was as eloquent as I would have expected, I still was reinforced in my decision on whom to vote for.
Men who are nearly 80 years old get cranky and confused. I saw that. Old men who don’t have time to get their facts “memorized” I saw that. I pray that Obama can get us back on track and out of this economic mess that Bush managed in his greedy retarded way to bring on us. However, no on possessing a working brain could ever vote for possibly the weakest ticket ever presented by republicans, unless they would like to stand in soup lines for food, because we are on the brink of ruin. But as long as the Saudi’s and the Bush’s are richer than ever, it’s all good.
I think it was obvious McCain spanked Obama in this Debate. It was funny listinging to Obama tell McCain he was right. LOL… he must have told McCain he either agreed with him or was right more then a dozen times! At the sametime McCain kept telling Obama he didn’t understand the issues. It was really a great night for McCain. Maybe Obama can do better in the next one.
It is ironic how one commenter, Jay, who claims to be an independent, pointed out that Obama was wrong on the fact about Kissinger but ignored the fact that McCain was off on the fact about Eisnhower–to be fair, both made similar degree of inaccuracy in their claims.
With that said…
On addressing issues:
McCain: he employs a style of reiterating his viewpoints to emphasize his understanding of issues, making his arguments clear and simple, yet a bit lacking in substance.
Obama: tends to employ logically reasoning building up arguments with different premises and evidence, then drawing his conclusion. So it may seem to an average citizen that he’s jumping from point to point, when he employs concrete examples to build up his argument, instead of simply repeating his stance.
On style:
McCain: has a very contemptious, confident, and determined air and tends to appeal to emotions by bringing up his personal experiences in dealing with veterans. He would also not look Obama in the eye and kept saying “Obama doesn’t understand” without supporting his claim of WHY and HOW he doesn’t understand.
Obama: too much on the defense side and too gentlemen-like; he starts off his rebuttal by addressing what they both agree on, then proceed to the contrast. Although it is out of courtesy, which obviously McCain lacks, but it came across as being weak.
On a side note, McCain, towards the end of the debate, insulted Obama on being as stubborn as Bush. If anything, Obama may be anything but Bush, especially when it is McCain himself whose view align with Bush 90% of the time.
Just my two cents: we need to vote for someone who can make better judgements in change the plight our country is in today. If our foreign diplomacy tactics of not sitting down with our enemies and have allowed them to proliferate and alienate ourselves more, we may want to try to sit down and talk. McCain wouldn’t do that. He thought the war on Iraq will be easy, quick, and cheap, he was WRONG. Two weeks ago, he said that under Bush Administration, the economy is still strong, look what’s happening now. Apparently, being there doesn’t make you right. What’s right for us is a person who has logical and rational judgments that work in our favor, for the people.
It looks like the “he doesn’t understand” tactic is working.. look, McCain did come off as “owning” the debate, but he did it in a very disrespectful way. He acted as if Obama wasn’t even there; he was completely zoned into his own world, spewing out the same stuff we’ve heard before. I don’t recall Obama using any of his campaign’s “change” tactics, correct me if I’m wrong. McCain does a good job at playing the emotional card… telling that story about the bracelet surely won him points. And it was funny that Obama jumped on that too, but I thought it was clever that he explained also how he got it, but in a different way than McCain’s. They both didn’t really stay on topic, but Obama’s responses were more specific and coherent. McCain’s responses seemed so general and vague, which is why he’ll probably get a good percentage of votes.. because most Americans need and want easy to understand responses!
I thought this one was a tie.
I agree 100% with Lynn if you switch the name “Obama” with “McCain” in her comments.
I don’t know what debate you were watching but McCain was angry, nasty, cynical while Obama was cool as a cucumber and a gentelmen as usual. You can tell McCain wanted to call him an “uppity nigger” but couldn’t.
Amazing how you Republican war mongers view things.
typo correction: Gentleman
I TOTALLY agree with you,Donkey Punch! I can’t believe that some people think McCain was the winner in this debate. Maybe they were watching a different debate than I was. McCain was totally cranky, rude, nasty and kept repeating the same things over and over! And yes, you could really get the feeling he wanted to call him “uppity Ni@#@r-sorry, I can’t even type that vile word. I can’t wait to see what Biden does to the Moose Killer! And why could he-not once! look at Obama? Really disrespectful.
John McCain came off a lot better than I expected him to, but I think that that was because he refused to debate Obama.
Remember the comments about how to do diplomacy with hostile governments? Obama made the point that you can’t make progress with people that you refuse to acknowledge or speak to? McCain kept shaking his head sadly over the upstart’s foolishness in suggesting that such governments should be engaged in dialogue “without precondition?”
Well, McCain approached Obama with the same policy. He didn’t look at Obama, and he consistently ignored the content of Obama’s statements. He refused to engage in an exchange of ideas, which is what debate (and foreign policy diploma) is all about. Instead he used the flimsiest of excuses to launch into already memorized little vignettes, carefully crafted by his speech writers. They were mostly about what a great guy he is, a man’s man, and the expert on waging war. Over and over again he incredulously repeated Obama’s statement that “the Surge succeeded beyond his wildest expectations.”
And there in lies the measure of the two men. Obama repeatedly and graciously acknowledged areas in which McCain was successful, and apparently is willing to do so even when his predictions are wrong. McCain, on the other hand, was not even enough of a gentleman to look at his opponent, and never acknowledged seven years of failed judgement during the course of this ruinous war.
I had never realized how like Bush McCain is until watching this debate. The phony empathy, the corny stories, the sarcasm and eye rolling… McCain has it all down.
I wish that Obama had been more forceful and dynamic, but he did eventually get there. And I would vote for a level-headed gentleman over a hot headed rude old man any day of the week. And incidentally, I am someone who normally has great respect for old age and experience. But unfortunately, this time around, the experienced politicians have led us into a quagmire, with our economy on the verge of collapse.
oh, i’ve been away for work and i’ve missed everyone!
i didn’t miss the debates.
i was sadly left wanting hillary to come in and knock both these bland yet childish boys off the playground. still undecided.
sigh.
I have watched the debate, and it was horrible to hear Senator McCain rambling sentences with no real meaning. His answers very vague, and often repeated words. Instead of giving solid answers to the questions asked, he often repeated his point that he is more experienced than Senator Obama. Senator McCain clearly has no credibility to back up his points on the economy and foreign diplomacy, its was not what you would expect from someone who is supposed to be experienced in diplomacy and politics.
This debate has again proven, that Senator McCain is not competent to be President of the U.S.A. and i hope that you would have realized that too.
Everyone who is criticizing Obama’s skills in the debate definitely didn’t understand what was going on. First of all McCain should have done better by a landslide.. foreign policy is supposed to be his area of expertise. Also, he really needed a clear win since he is down in the polls, Obama just has to maintain. Secondly Mccain’s anger issues throughout the debate were a huge turn off to everyone, its fine if he wants to get angry with Obama but getting angry with the host is unacceptable. If you watched the debate on cnn friday night after it was over there was a panel discussing it and clearly Obama was the winner. I think the most disappointing thing of the whole night was that Sarah Palin didn’t comment on McCain and an advisor had to do that. It looked horrible in contrast to the Obama camp having Biden comment afterwards as was expected. Before McCain had chosen Palin as his VP I thought that he was a reasonable choice for president and there are ideological differences between him and Obama, but he does have certain skills and experience which would make him a good president. Since he has chosen Palin, I am in shock. Unbelievable. The only reason he could have chosen her is so that he has someone who he can dominate while in office and have her just carry out his instructions, because clearly she is unprepared and that is not what someone so close to potentially being president should be.
Article about the real McCain the Conservative run media won’t let you see:
http://www.moderateindependent.com/v6iSEPT152008McCain.htm
Nice link, Donkey Punch. It serves up the real John McCain nice and neat. And it reminds me of another aspect of this man/campaign: his absolute narcissism.
During McCain’s debriefing following his release as a POW, a psychiatrist who assessed him made reference to his histrionic personality, which is just another way to describe someone who loves to create chaos.
Look at all of McCain’s grandstanding re: the bail out crisis: 1.) The candidates must withdraw from the presidential campaign until this crisis is resolved, which requires McCain’s physical presence, so the debate must be postponed. 2.) McCain will not participate in the debate if there is not a resolution of the bail out legislation. 3.) McCain will not participate in the debate unless significant progress is made with the bail out plan. 4.) McCain IS going to participate in the debate, even though this action contradicts all of his previous, and ever changing, stances. And after the debate? 5.) He can handle everything that needs to be done to resolve this crisis by phone.
Ugh. I cringe to think of the consequences to our country if this major personality disorder is elected.
And why is the issue of Cindy McCain’s drug addiction and criminal embezzlement from her own charity never discussed in the main stream press? If this were Michelle Obama’s history, we would never hear the end of it from our supposed ‘free’ press.
IMHO, neither won as both were snide and childish. The bigger point is we keep losing, and but apparently we like to lose, because we keep nominating losers and expecting the outcome to be different.
Ever hear the quote “The office of Vice President isn’t worth a bucket of warm spit”?
Who cares about Sarah Palin and Joe Biden. Historically, the office of Vice President is meaningless. Either one will wind up being a footnote in history.
Concentrate on Obama and McCain.